Tuesday, January 23, 2007

Chance pt. 2

So if you have done any science/religion apologetics at all, you have heard something like the post below or this comment. "If the earth were only such and such closer to the sun then we would burn up, and if we were only such and such farther away we would freeze, another proof of God." Although awe-inspiring, I don't think that is good enough for the mature Christian to build his or her faith upon. I think you just might meet someone who has a few other questions about this "Set-up job by a Perfect and Loving God"

Here is just one of many questions for you to throw around this week that you might hear from an Atheist about this kind of faith/science statement.

"So what about Skin Cancer? For a perfectly positioned planet, that doesn't seem to be that perfect. Ice Ages? Global Warming?"


The Cachinnator said...

Though it is certain that nature testifies to God, a Christian would indeed be foolish to use it to "prove" God. The "God of the Gaps" shrinks along with those gaps as our scientific understanding increases. We can't just let God be all that we don't understand.

Similarly we shouldn't use archeology to prove Scripture. When they conflict, and they frequently do, you either have to look at the facts and say, "nuh uh," or you have to say that Scripture is a lie if you've built your faith in Scripture upon archeology.

God's a lot bigger than we give him credit for.

euphrony said...

But Jesus answered, "I tell you, if these become silent, the stones will cry out!" (Luke 19:40, NASB)

I have long felt that, if we rely on nature to define and glorify God, then we have shirked out own duty to do so. Are we so quiet that the stones arfe the only ones speaking?

Seth Ward said...

Euphony I love your comment, however I keep imagining a stone arfing. I can't stop cracking up about it. What translation are you reading?

On a serious note, what a profound and cosmic verse huh?

Seth Ward said...

Sorry EuphRony.

Seth Ward said...

Cach, I like that God of the gaps shrinking bit. However, it never seems to me that science shrinks God. Multiple universes? Quantum fluxuations? Dark Matter? Seems like God just gets bigger all the time. Of course, that could be because I am a tad bit of a Christian.

I think there is something most Atheists miss when they argue against Christianity. The idea that Christ holds all things together. They have this psuedo Deistic view and go from there, shrinking God to a smaller and smaller vairable. This is not Christianity.

Jesus in the Hypostatic union is breathtaking but so is Jesus as Logos, active in sustaining matter and life at every moment. True God of True God. The "cosmic" Jesus so to speak. That whole appropriation stuff gets me fired up.

btw, if you ever want to get into a good discussion with an x-christian/atheist go to meetanatheist.com

Alan is a cool guy. A little angry, but hey, who can blame him?

The Cachinnator said...

Unfortunately, it's not only atheists with that pseudo-Deistic view; many Christians limit their conception of God to the edge of their reason. Thank you, Enlightenment. I agree it's not true Christianity, but it is common among those who see the God of the gaps.

euphrony said...

Seth, I am a person who regularly writes papers, so I try to give a proper notation of the reference I use.

NASB - New Arf-Speak Bible

euphrony said...

As to the "God of the gaps":
Being a scientist, going through academia and working with these people who define the "gaps", I can tell you that most (in my experience) are not atheists but are deists of a sort. They see the complexity of nature, balanced with the beautiful simplicity of how it all works out together, and they see the hand of a designer. But this is as far as their deism usually goes: reverence without worship.

(Or were you talking about the "God of The Gap®"? Sorry.)

Seth Ward said...

Ha! No, God doesn't wear kakis. At least I think he don't i reckon. (head scratch)

I have actually found that to be true as well. I think that is the fault of the Church's rigid and peursecuting hand before the enlightenment.

operamama said...

one could blame all those problems on man, not God. God didn't intend for us to burn up the atmosphere with all of our freakin' hairspray, and other...chloroflorocarbons...(last word added my operapapa.---i wouldn't know that word from butt.)